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America: A Christian Nation - Really? You Betcha!
The following excerpt was taken from:
Is President Obama Correct: Is America No Longer a Christian Nation?
by Dr. David Barton
April 2009
http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=23909
Thanks to Joyce Sappington and Dave Gant for bringing this post to our attention! Click on Founding Fathers and Religion in America, to review a similar post that also addresses this subject by Dr. Brion McClanahan, Ph.D., author of The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Founding Fathers.
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Contemporary post-modern critics (including President Obama) who assert that America is not a Christian nation always refrain from offering any definition of what the term “Christian nation” means. So what is an accurate definition of that term as demonstrated by the American experience?
Contrary to what critics imply, a Christian nation is not one in which all citizens are Christians, or the laws require everyone to adhere to Christian theology, or all leaders are Christians, or any other such superficial measurement. As Supreme Court Justice David Brewer (1837-1910) explained:
[I]n what sense can [America] be called a Christian nation? Not in the sense that Christianity is the established religion or that the people are in any manner compelled to support it. On the contrary, the Constitution specifically provides that “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” Neither is it Christian in the sense that all its citizens are either in fact or name Christians. On the contrary, all religions have free scope within our borders. Numbers of our people profess other religions, and many reject all. Nor is it Christian in the sense that a profession of Christianity is a condition of holding office or otherwise engaging in public service, or essential to recognition either politically or socially. In fact, the government as a legal organization is independent of all religions. Nevertheless, we constantly speak of this republic as a Christian nation – in fact, as the leading Christian nation of the world.
So, if being a Christian nation is not based on any of the above criterion, then what makes America a Christian nation? According to Justice Brewer, America was “of all the nations in the world . . . most justly called a Christian nation” because Christianity “has so largely shaped and molded it.”
Constitutional law professor Edward Mansfield (1801-1880) similarly acknowledged: "In every country, the morals of a people – whatever they may be – take their form and spirit from their religion. For example, the marriage of brothers and sisters was permitted among the Egyptians because such had been the precedent set by their gods, Isis and Osiris. So, too, the classic nations celebrated the drunken rites of Bacchus. Thus, too, the Turk has become lazy and inert because dependent upon Fate, as taught by the Koran. And when in recent times there arose a nation [i.e., France] whose philosophers [e.g. Voltaire, Rousseau, Diderot, Helvetius, etc.] discovered there was no God and no religion, the nation was thrown into that dismal case in which there was no law and no morals. . . . In the United States, Christianity is the original, spontaneous, and national religion."
Founding Father and U. S. Supreme Court Chief Justice John Marshall agreed: "[W]ith us, Christianity and religion are identified. It would be strange, indeed, if with such a people our institutions did not presuppose Christianity and did not often refer to it and exhibit relations with it.
Christianity is the religion that shaped America and made her what she is today. In fact, historically speaking, it can be irrefutably demonstrated that Biblical Christianity in America produced many of the cherished traditions still enjoyed today, including:
A republican rather than a theocratic form of government;
The institutional separation of church and state (as opposed to today’s enforced institutional secularization of church and state);
Protection for religious toleration and the rights of conscience;
A distinction between theology and behavior, thus allowing the incorporation into public policy of religious principles that promote good behavior but which do not enforce theological tenets (examples of this would include religious teachings such as the Good Samaritan, The Golden Rule, the Ten Commandments, the Sermon on the Mount, etc., all of which promote positive civil behavior but do not impose ecclesiastical rites); and A free-market approach to religion, thus ensuring religious diversity.
Consequently, a Christian nation as demonstrated by the American experience is a nation founded upon Christian and Biblical principles, whose values, society, and institutions have largely been shaped by those principles. This definition was reaffirmed by American legal scholars and historians for generations but is widely ignored by today’s revisionists.
Is President Obama Correct: Is America No Longer a Christian Nation?
by Dr. David Barton
April 2009
http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=23909
Thanks to Joyce Sappington and Dave Gant for bringing this post to our attention! Click on Founding Fathers and Religion in America, to review a similar post that also addresses this subject by Dr. Brion McClanahan, Ph.D., author of The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Founding Fathers.
*************************
Contemporary post-modern critics (including President Obama) who assert that America is not a Christian nation always refrain from offering any definition of what the term “Christian nation” means. So what is an accurate definition of that term as demonstrated by the American experience?
Contrary to what critics imply, a Christian nation is not one in which all citizens are Christians, or the laws require everyone to adhere to Christian theology, or all leaders are Christians, or any other such superficial measurement. As Supreme Court Justice David Brewer (1837-1910) explained:
[I]n what sense can [America] be called a Christian nation? Not in the sense that Christianity is the established religion or that the people are in any manner compelled to support it. On the contrary, the Constitution specifically provides that “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” Neither is it Christian in the sense that all its citizens are either in fact or name Christians. On the contrary, all religions have free scope within our borders. Numbers of our people profess other religions, and many reject all. Nor is it Christian in the sense that a profession of Christianity is a condition of holding office or otherwise engaging in public service, or essential to recognition either politically or socially. In fact, the government as a legal organization is independent of all religions. Nevertheless, we constantly speak of this republic as a Christian nation – in fact, as the leading Christian nation of the world.
So, if being a Christian nation is not based on any of the above criterion, then what makes America a Christian nation? According to Justice Brewer, America was “of all the nations in the world . . . most justly called a Christian nation” because Christianity “has so largely shaped and molded it.”
Constitutional law professor Edward Mansfield (1801-1880) similarly acknowledged: "In every country, the morals of a people – whatever they may be – take their form and spirit from their religion. For example, the marriage of brothers and sisters was permitted among the Egyptians because such had been the precedent set by their gods, Isis and Osiris. So, too, the classic nations celebrated the drunken rites of Bacchus. Thus, too, the Turk has become lazy and inert because dependent upon Fate, as taught by the Koran. And when in recent times there arose a nation [i.e., France] whose philosophers [e.g. Voltaire, Rousseau, Diderot, Helvetius, etc.] discovered there was no God and no religion, the nation was thrown into that dismal case in which there was no law and no morals. . . . In the United States, Christianity is the original, spontaneous, and national religion."
Founding Father and U. S. Supreme Court Chief Justice John Marshall agreed: "[W]ith us, Christianity and religion are identified. It would be strange, indeed, if with such a people our institutions did not presuppose Christianity and did not often refer to it and exhibit relations with it.
Christianity is the religion that shaped America and made her what she is today. In fact, historically speaking, it can be irrefutably demonstrated that Biblical Christianity in America produced many of the cherished traditions still enjoyed today, including:
A republican rather than a theocratic form of government;
The institutional separation of church and state (as opposed to today’s enforced institutional secularization of church and state);
Protection for religious toleration and the rights of conscience;
A distinction between theology and behavior, thus allowing the incorporation into public policy of religious principles that promote good behavior but which do not enforce theological tenets (examples of this would include religious teachings such as the Good Samaritan, The Golden Rule, the Ten Commandments, the Sermon on the Mount, etc., all of which promote positive civil behavior but do not impose ecclesiastical rites); and A free-market approach to religion, thus ensuring religious diversity.
Consequently, a Christian nation as demonstrated by the American experience is a nation founded upon Christian and Biblical principles, whose values, society, and institutions have largely been shaped by those principles. This definition was reaffirmed by American legal scholars and historians for generations but is widely ignored by today’s revisionists.
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ChristianNation.pdf, 677 KB
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by DaveG on -
This is an excellent article to keep on hand, Jim. Thanks to you and Joyce for digging this one out.
It is not only well worth the read, but a good one to share with others.
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Permalink Reply by Jim Robinson on -
This article is only one of a great many down through American history that clearly refute the insane argument that our country was never founded on Christian and Biblical principles, values, and morality. Our Christian and Biblical heritage is not a debate (or a bait for our trolls to come running) but a historical fact that has been well documented and researched by a great many unbiased scholars, historians, judges, lawyers, Founding Fathers and Framers with no politically correct axe to grind or agenda to rewrite the history books to cover up our roots and heritage.
For too long have we allowed the Liberal-Progressive-Socialists in this country to rewrite history and drive Christianity out of the Public Arena in our society and culture. So, for the sake of our Liberal-challenged friends, let me reemphasize a point that they often overlook and neglect when they try to refute all solid conservative evidence and arguments that prove them wrong and biased -- We are not a Christian nation because of theology or theocracy, but because of our behavior and the unique role that Judeo-Christianity played in shaping America into what she is today.
Christians, and other religious folks, will no longer be pushed to the back of the bus, or swept under the carpet, to feed the egos and agendas of those that want to reject and deny our proven Judeo-Christian heritage and roots. We the People are not as gullible or stupid as they want us to believe - except, of course, for maybe the Wards of the State!
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Permalink Reply by Jim Robinson on
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It never ceases to amuse and amaze me how quickly arrogant and intolerant men will attempt to hijack any principled discussion on the undeniable historical roots and heritage of Judeo-Christianity over the course and history of this great Republic. While men are entitled to their religious insensibilities and hostilities, they are not entitled to corrupt the Truth or to rewrite history to suit their politically correct fancies and whims - and the rest of us are freely entitled to acknowledge and celebrate our roots and heritage without constant harassment and barrage from fools and idiots that hide among us.
This forum is for those of us that freely choose to acknowledge and celebrate our Judeo-Christian heritage that is not open to foolish debate and pointless argument. I will say this again for the benefit of a few that have already tried to crash this party: if this discussion offends you in any way, please move on quietly without trying to hijack, attack, and disrupt this conversation. Religious intolerance will not be tolerated on this particular forum - end of discussion.
Thank you, folks! Now, let this joyous celebration of our Judeo-Christian roots and heritage continue without further harassment or intimidation by our trolls and troublemakers still skulking around TCU.
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Permalink Reply by lisa mincey on -
amen jim and again amen
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Permalink Reply by Jim Robinson on
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Wow, Lisa! I only had to deal with the VA Hospital today, new medication, one troll that had to be banned by Earl for abusive behavior, and 4 other idiots that tried to hijack this discussion thread just to expose and express their arrogance and intolerance of all things Christian. You would have thought by now that these trolls and troublemakers would have learned that ganging up on me doesn't work - even when I'm drugged out on medication and have 2 arms behind my back! :D
So, I will only say this one last time on this forum. Folks, if you really don't like the subject matter of this discussion thread, have enough courtesy, decency, maturity, and responsibility to simply walk away quietly without making a total moron of yourself by trying to hijack, attack, and disrupt this thread. It really is as simple as that! Abusive behavior reflects poorly on you, certainly not on me, and it will get you banned from this site (which, for some of you, might be yet again for the umpteenth time). This is no game, and TCU will not tolerate abusive behavior. Good night, everyone!
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Permalink Reply by lisa mincey on
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i know jim...i am so sorry about you having to go to the hospital...i truly hope you are ok...i will keep you lifted up in prayer...blessings my friend and hope you have a great night...keep speaking the truth..it is what you do best....you have a far more powerful base to stand on than the trolls and trouble makers...
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Permalink Reply by lisa mincey on
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get over it william...are you really this insane?...my gosh...leave it alone...get over yourself...jim has asked you to stop responding in an argumentative way and you keep after it...i believe i see bellvue in your picture...again, if you don't like this forum....LEAVE....walk away...stop your insane mind from re-acting...are you this out of control that you cannot stop yourself?..
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Permalink Reply by DaveG on
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Aaron, you apparently did not read the article - or you read into it what you desired to hear. The article itself makes clear that we were indeed founded by men with Christian values and a strong Biblical background. It also makes it clear that these men in no way were trying to force their religious views on anyone - and did in fact go to great lengths to make clear the tolerance of those that expressed differing views regarding the worship of their God - or even the freedom to have no God if they chose such.
To claim that America there, was and is a Christian nation is not UN-AMERICAN as you have so stated ... there is no attempt to force those beliefs on anyone. Recognizing not only the historical but practical benefits of Christianity as it has influenced our nation - and will continue to do so - in no way establishes a state religion.
From my take on it, I think that was the gist of the article. And one thing I enjoyed about it, was it was written in pretty plain English. If you disagree fine. State so and move on ... there is no reason to make this into a personal attack against TCU or any of their team.
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Permalink Reply by Iron Tigers Vet on -
I understand the point that the TCU admins make about not "hijacking" the site. But seriously, when these trolls come in, yes they really get my bloodpressure up also, but wow are they funny.
I say funny because they truley show their lack of intelligence spouting the propaganda that they do. They can't think for themselves, due to all the spoonfed lies, so they have to "overtalk" everyone without points of intellect in order to make points that aren't reliable or factual.
I seem to think it's very interesting to challenge these morons because when they can't come up with viable data to show they are correct then it always shuts them up anyway. Just one more troll or slug (as I like to refer to them) getting shut down by facts, just like it used to be with CD.
Just like all the other conservative sites, they will always be around to torture us with lies and guilt, but as they say... the ones trying to blame are the ones usually guilty.
As Winston Churchill once said... "The malice of the wicked is reinforced by the weakness of the virtuous"
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Permalink Reply by lisa mincey on
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amen christopher and now the virtuous are speaking up loudly and the wicked don't know how to handle it...their little ploys are not working anymore....talk about shock and awe...lol...truly funny to behold such a sight...
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Permalink Reply by Jim Robinson on
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Then move on quietly, Aaron, and quit being so childish and obnoxious! By your own actions have you made this personal, and your attempts to help hijack this discussion for your entertainment factor will not be tolerated. Period - end of story. Have I made myself clear?! (And, for the record, I freely posted this forum at the request of other good folks here - knowing that our jerks, morons, fools, idiots, trolls, and troublemakers would come out of the woodwork to converge their attacks on me personally. And these self-professed Einstein's took the bait - hook, line, and sinker!)
Their immaturity, hostility, and intolerance are glaring to everyone present - but themselves, of course. Aaron himself appears to be our troll Marilyn Merrick in yet another disguise? For those that are new and do not know her, Marilyn is one of our most vicious and persistent trolls, and she does have quite an "identity" problem - along with the rest of the DPS gang (Dead Patriots Society). Aaron acts and talks like Marilyn - and that was definitely not a compliment.
The facts of history simply are what they are - irrespective of the often arrogant, childish, and intolerant opinions of fools and idiots that try to rewrite history. Their debate is not with me but with over 400 years of proven American history, so they can take their collective intolerances someplace else; this is not the place or forum for them to gather. That includes Aaron, William Taylor, Jaro, Renee Royer, and the rest of their skulking band of fools and idiots.
I am personally not going to waste my time (or this forum) getting angry with these morons just because they don't know when to shut up and just quietly walk away like true civilized human beings. Like I told Lisa yesterday, even on my worst days should our trolls and troublemakers know better than to gang up on me - even collectively are they no match for my stand for Truth and against all forms of lies, error, and deception! And they are certainly no match for 400 plus years of rich Judeo-Christian history and heritage here in America. America is a Christian nation not because we are a theocracy but because Judeo-Christianity is the religion that shaped America and made her what she is today! Opinion - no; Fact - yes! The majority of Americans still know this to be true, and we will continue to recognize and celebrate this glorious fact long after our critics pass on into the night (and, dare I say, into irrelevance)!
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Permalink Reply by Iron Tigers Vet on
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Jim, just to show that Christian belief is so strong in this country. There is a great story on WND that talks about a county in Florida that is having a 90 hour bible reading coming up.
It was only supposed to be for a one time thing, but so many people enjoyed it and so many other counties and even in other states joined in, they are doing it again this year. Great stuff.
It's times and stories like that that tell congress to take their "hate crimes" bill and shove it where the sun doesn't shine.
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