Comment

Comment by LarryNC on June 17, 2009 at 1:17pm

Allen, wanted to quickly address your response concerning taxes. I agree we need to be thoughtful in our approach. My comment wasn’t so much to imply a complete refusal of paying taxes - hope it didn’t come across in that manner. I only brought up the question concerning Nick’s point of battling with the issue of God vs. Country and the ethical/moral struggles he’s having. I feel as freedoms erode and anti-Christian policies are imposed on us, this is a discussion that will continue to take on more importance. But again back to your remark – we need to be thoughtful.

Comment by Daniel Deon Delk on June 17, 2009 at 12:51pm

Y'all should hear Rush today, he is absolutely slamming Obama and the liar that he is. Obama is destroying America.....SPEAK UP, SPEAK OUT..

TO GOD BE THE GLORY,

Comment by Allen Smith on June 17, 2009 at 5:53am

Just a thought before I go to work.

…they will see your honorable behavior, and they will believe and give honor to God when he comes to judge the world.
1 Peter 2:12

Comment by Allen Smith on June 17, 2009 at 1:18am

In regard to the bill now under consideration, I have been thinking about the goals of its supporters. It appears to me that the bill is not just intended to quiet our pulpits, it will have a greater affect on alternative media than any fairness doctrine. Every word that is spoken by Rush, Levin, Medved or Hewitt will be used to shut them down for good. Hannity will be no more, Savage will be labeled a fringe nut job that needs to be quieted or worse. It is frightening what they can do with this type of legislation.

Comment by LarryNC on June 17, 2009 at 1:15am

Gentleman,
It is after 2 AM here and although this is wonderful dialog, I have to admit my brain retired long ago (ahead of the rest of me) and I have to get up early. If I can reconnect tomorrow and continue the discussion, I would love to.
Best to all and God's blessings,
Larry

Comment by Nick Cleghorn on June 17, 2009 at 1:04am

I personally believe that had we, as colonists, applied the verse: "Render therefore unto Caesar..." at the beginning of the Revolution we would still be subjects of England. We are also to obey God rather that man, and we have to make a decision where the dividing line is. I believe the dividing line is "evil."

If Caesar encourages or perpetrates evil I believe it is my duty as a Christian to stand up for God's principles no matter what the cost. Isn't this what our forefathers did? If our government wasn't funding the killing of babies and now, indirectly, sodomy, I would have no problem. But they are and now I have a problem. Serve my country or my God? It's really not a problem for me. Very clear what my responsibilites are.

BTW folks, I do try to use spell-check but sometimes I may still leave errors due to the fact that I am dyslexic. I will do my best to insure that my posts are at least intelligible. :-)

Comment by Allen Smith on June 17, 2009 at 1:03am

Good questions Larry. I will answer them in this way.

As to the Boston tea party: the revolt was against an increase in taxes, not a paying of them. The colonists were not averse to paying their taxes, they were troubled but the arbitrary increase of those taxes to provide the crown with coin that they could not get from other holdings. If you study the conditions of the day, Americans enjoyed a greater standard of living than most any civilized society of its age. They ate more meat, drank more beer, had greater resources available to them and in general were better off than their cousins across the pond. The order to pay a tea tax was vexing because America got all of its non native resources from Britain. And remember, the tea tax followed the stamp tax so it was viewed as more of a grab by the crown, it was not as we have it today, the colonists did not care why the taxes were being levied, just that they were.

They did attempt to address this directly to King George, via a representative to the court, but the order stood. Do not forget that many colonists were not of the same mind, and did not support the revolt. Those that abstained were fearful of the response it would provoke. And as we all know it led to the revolution that birthed this great nation.

Now, getting to the heart of your question; Were hey wrong in their actions? No. However, they had at that time the benefit of being somewhat removed from their protagonist, although the projection of British power was always a threat. But I say this with a caveat: They were correct in apposing arbitrary taxation of a punitive sort. We on the other hand do not have a buffer between us and the powers that be, and paying taxes, if moderate, is not generally opposed. The greater problem we face is opposing the use of those taxes to promote and finance the very behaviors that destroy societies and seek to obliterate our way of life. I am not advising a submission, I am only encouraging a more thoughtful approach, one that could have a better chance of success with greater effect and less risk of redounding in the negative.

If we move in that direction, we must be prepared to reap the whirlwind that will come for us. They hate us already, they will seek to use every means to end our discourse, worship, and gathering in the name of God. It will come to that some day, and soon I fear. But I would rather it not be now. We have much to do in His name yet. Let us give ourselves the chance to do it.

In Him as always,

Allen

Comment by LarryNC on June 17, 2009 at 12:32am

Osher - I recently heard someone present the argument that if we withheld taxes, they wouldn’t have the ability to promote their agenda. You articulated that well.

Comment by LarryNC on June 17, 2009 at 12:16am

Allen, as always I so appreciate your comments and perspective. Great thing about being the group moderator (versus the group know-it-all) is I have the luxury of asking questions, not necessarily answering them.

I understand your statement of “Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be Caesar's, and unto God the things which be God's” but I would ask - did the original participants of the Boston Tea Party follow the same criteria and were they wrong in their actions? Should they merely have gone with the laws/taxes inflicted on them and not shown any discourse?

At what point do we say enough is enough? You stated “Obama is driving this country to ruin as fast as he can”. Where do we take a stand against that and what does “taking a stand” actually mean?

Just wanted to present that – seems that both sides have valid arguments. Thoughts?

Comment by Allen Smith on June 16, 2009 at 11:20pm

Hey there all, This whole situation is getting out of hand. Obama is driving this country to ruin as fast as he can. However, as Christians we need to think before we act. For many years we have seen WWJD bumper sticker, key chains and bracelets. We now need to ask "What would Jesus do?". or more to the point, 'What would Jesus have us do?'. In times of crisis and trouble, we are to turn to scripture for our cues, and as painful as it may be we have limits placed on us that we must abide by if we are to follow in His footsteps.

I hate the fact t hat our tax dollars are going to fund and reward abhorrent behavior, pay for congressional goodies and cover the tab for a night out on the town just for kicks. But we must always strive to represent God in the way He proscribed for us. Who among us can say that we are above the law? If we pay our taxes we have complied with the letter of the law even if we despise the spirit of the law that we are subject too. That is what is important. What the government does is of great concern, but not paying your taxes in protest will only end in tragedy. Unintentional slips and mistakes in tax filings by good solid citizens, have cost them untold grief and countless dollars to correct: an intentional failure will surly be quashed with vigor. We must find a better way to keep our tax dollars out of the hands of filthy mongers. So lets put our heads together and find a solution. We can be obedient to both God and the law of the land without compromising our beliefs. I leave you with this admonition Christ gave to those who challenged Him about honoring the law:

Luke 20:25 And he said unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which be Caesar's, and unto God the things which be God's.

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• …
• 35
• 36
• 37
• 38
• 39
• …
• 78
• Next ›
• Page